For the National Year of Reading, we are sharing a series of short conversations with people who are involved in promoting reading with young people. This could be a programme, resources or a literary event, and we’re giving them the opportunity to share what they do and how people can get involved.
In this episode we are joined by Sarah Satha the Chair of Inclusive Books for Children.
Inclusive Books for Children is a charity whose vision is for every child in the UK to grow up reading inclusive books. They want to nurture the next generation of open-minded and inspired young readers and have created a free website to make it easy for parents, caregivers, librarians and teachers to find and buy diverse titles, confident they have made excellent choices. Updated each month, all the books on their website are rigorously appraised by experts in children’s literature with backgrounds in education, libraries, academia and publishing.
Each year, they donate 1000s of high-quality, engaging inclusive books to nurseries, schools and libraries with the greatest need via our IBC Book Box gifting scheme.
They also run the IBC Book Awards which celebrate outstanding new inclusive children’s books and their talented creators. Their Children’s Choice Awards shadowing scheme runs in tandem with the main IBC Awards. The scheme gives children the opportunity to engage in the awards process as mini-judges, reading the shortlist and voting on their favourites.
Ali
0:11
Hi,
I'm
Ali.
Katy
0:12
And
I'm
Katie
and
welcome
to
Mostly
Book
Talk.
Ali
0:15
This
episode
is
one
of
a
series
we're
doing
about
book-related
charities
and
what
they're
doing
in
the
national
year
of
reading.
Katy
0:21
In
this
episode,
we
are
pleased
to
welcome
Sarah
Satha,
who
is
the
chair
of
Inclusive
Books
for
Children.
Welcome.
We're
really
pleased
to
have
with
us
today
Sarah
Satha,
who
is
the
co-founder
of
Inclusive
Books
for
Children
or
the
IBC.
So
welcome
Sarah.
Tell
us
a
bit
about
what
Inclusive
Books
for
Children
does.
Sarah
0:46
Sure.
Thank
you
so
much
for
asking
me
to
participate.
IBC
is
obviously
a
charity,
and
I
founded
it
with
my
husband
four
years
ago
because,
from
a
parent
perspective,
we
were
really
struggling
to
find
books
that
we
felt
comfortable
sharing
with
our
own
eldest
child
as
she
reached
that
age
of
sharing
books
and
introducing
reading
together.
We
are
an
interracial
couple,
and
our
kid
is
our
eldest
has
brown
skin,
and
we
really
didn't
feel
that
there
was
anything
that
would
show
her
that
she
belonged
in
the
world
of
stories.
So
we
started
this
project
and
it
really
snowballed
and
has
become
what
it
is
today.
And
our
flagship
project,
the
main
USP
of
IBC,
is
our
website,
which
is
effectively
a
searchable
database
of
all
the
best
inclusive
children's
books
for
ages
one
to
nine
ever
published
in
the
UK.
And
they're
all
double
reviewed
by
experts,
librarians,
teachers,
writers,
people
in
publishing,
and
always
with
an
eye
to
both
the
quality
of
the
text
and
the
illustrations
and
the
quality
of
the
inclusivity
and
representation.
And
the
mission
is
to
just
make
it
really
easy
for
everybody
to
find
the
perfect
inclusive
book
for
any
particular
child
or
any
particular
occasion.
So
you
can
either
search
for
a
specific
book
or
use
our
curated
book
lists.
Katy
2:14
Nice.
And
how
far
back
do
you
go
now?
Because
it's
quite
a
job
building
that
type
of
database,
isn't
it?
Sarah
2:20
Uh
yeah.
So
we
started
the
charity
started
in
2022,
but
I
started
collecting
inclusive
books
for
my
child
before
that.
And
I
got
a
little
bit
carried
away.
And
I
would
scrape
the
internet
and
follow
niche
blogs.
And
actually,
in
the
end,
when
I
came
to
cataloguing
it,
because
I
thought
this
was
a
lot
of
work
and
maybe
I
should
share
it
on
the
internet
freely,
it
was
already
300
books.
And
then
we
met
other
like-minded
people
and
started
becoming
more
aware
of
who
else
was
in
this
space,
and
more
people
joined
the
team,
and
it
it
just
grew
and
grew.
And
now
we've
got
well
over
a
thousand,
probably
close
to
one
and
a
half
thousand
brilliant
inclusive
books
on
the
site.
Nice.
Katy
3:04
And
at
the
moment,
what
age
groups
does
it
cover?
Because
you
started
quite
young,
didn't
you?
And
it's
got
older.
Sarah
3:10
Yeah.
So
we've
it's
one
to
nine,
but
we
haven't
actually
mentioned
this
to
anyone
yet.
But
we're
looking
at
adding
middle
grade,
but
maybe
not
in
the
same
exhaustive
way
because
it's
a
much
bigger
space
and
it's
yeah,
it
takes
it's
much
more
resource
intensive
to
review.
So
I
think
we're
gonna
do
a
little
kind
of
cream
of
the
crop
offering.
Okay.
Katy
3:31
Just
the
best
of
the
best.
Yeah.
Yeah,
it
just
takes
that
bit
longer
to
read
the
books,
doesn't
it?
Because
to
do
the
reviews.
That's
a
challenge
that
we
face
regularly.
This
is
books
published
in
the
UK.
Do
you
have
a
pull-in
international
books?
Sarah
3:43
Yeah,
the
website
is
not
so
strictly
defined.
So
if
a
reviewer
or
one
of
the
people
involved
in
procurement
wants
to
bring
in
a
book
or
a
publisher
sends
us
a
book
that's
not
published
in
the
UK
but
is
only
published
abroad,
if
we
think
it
fits
and
we
love
it,
we'll
include
it
anyway.
Katy
4:01
Yeah,
because
you
can
get
hold
of
pretty
much
anything
now.
Sarah
4:03
Exactly.
It
can
be
broader
than
that.
What
you
find
on
the
website
can
be
broader.
But
other
aspects
of
our
work,
such
as
our
annual
IBC
Awards
or
our
excluded
voices
report,
which
goes
into
own
voice
main
character
representation
and
kind
of
does
an
analysis
of
how
many
main
characters,
what
marginalized
group
do
they
belong
to,
and
who
was
writing
that
story.
Those
kinds
of
projects
that
we
work
on
are
much
stricter
in
in
terms
of
what
books
we're
looking
at,
and
it
really
will
only
be
UK.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Katy
4:38
Okay.
And
so
tell
us
about
the
report.
How
often
do
you
do
it
and
what
does
it
have
in
it?
What
can
people
find
out
from
it?
Sarah
4:46
We
have
done
the
report
twice,
and
we're
in
the
middle
of
preparing
the
third
one.
And
so
the
report
looks
at
UK
published
books
for
ages
one
to
nine.
We
divide
it
into
the
same
categories
as
our
awards,
which
is
baby
and
toddler
books,
picture
books,
and
illustrated
children's
fiction
for
ages
kind
of
six
to
nine.
And
it
does
a
kind
of
detailed
analysis
by
marginalized
group,
and
we're
only
looking
at
main
characters.
So
we'll
have
different
ethnic
groupings
and
disabled
and
neurodivergent
main
characters.
And
not
only
do
we
offer
a
very
detailed
breakdown
and
various
angles
on
that,
comparing
it
to
actual
demographics
of
the
intended
readership,
but
also
we'll
look
at
whether
those
books
were
written
or
illustrated
from
an
own
voice
perspective.
So
that
means
that
the
author
or
illustrator,
or
maybe
both,
were
sharing
a
story
from
a
perspective
of
lived
experience
featuring
a
character
that
shares
the
same
marginalized
aspect
of
their
identity.
So
for
example,
a
black
author
writing
about
a
black
main
character.
Katy
5:58
Okay.
And
when's
the
the
next
iteration
of
that
coming
out,
the
next
version
edition
of
that
coming
out?
That
will
be
in
October.
Okay.
And
then
who's
that
aimed
at?
That's
aimed
at
a
general
audience,
but
also
presumably
at
publishers?
Sarah
6:12
Yeah,
I
think
who
wouldn't
be
interested
to
read
it?
But
publishers
are
probably
the
number
one
target
audience
for
that,
but
also
lots
of
teachers,
librarians,
and
authors
and
illustrators
also
sign
up
for
that,
yeah.
Katy
6:28
And
it
it
gives
the
overall
figures.
Does
it
actually
identify
the
books?
Sarah
6:32
Is
there
like
a
sort
of
a
list
that
you've
identified
through
that
or
so
every
year
we'll
publish
in
the
report
a
list
of
uh
picks
from
that
particular
year.
Right.
And
in
some
categories,
the
own
voice
representation
is
so
thin
that
it
will
be
all
of
them
and
it
will
hardly
take
any.
And
I'm
speaking
particularly
about
baby
and
toddler
books.
Um,
there'll
be
very
few
baby
and
toddler
books
with
a
main
character
of
colour
or
who
is
disabled
or
neurodivergent,
and
even
vanishingly
few
who
will
then
have
an
author
who
shares
in
that
identity.
And
then
also
we
have
an
accompanying
list
on
our
website,
which
is
bigger.
It'll
be,
it'll
go
back.
So
it'll
just
be
recommended
own
voice
titles
across
the
years.
Katy
7:20
Okay,
excellent.
So
your
last
edition
of
that
is
obviously
available
now.
The
new
one
will
be
available
in
October.
Yeah.
Interesting.
And
so,
what
about
your
awards?
Ali
7:31
Yes.
Tell
us
about
the
awards.
Sarah
7:32
I'd
love
to.
The
awards
is
a
real
highlight
in
our
calendar,
especially
because
we
all
work
remotely
around
England
or
and
the
UK
and
the
world.
So
it's
an
amazing
occasion
that
we
can
come
together
in
real
life
and
celebrate
the
work
and
these
books.
And
so
the
awards
have
been
running
for
as
long
as
IBC
has,
and
they
celebrate
the
best
inclusive
children's
books
published
each
year.
And
it
follows
those
same
categories
that
I
mentioned.
So
we
have
baby
and
toddler,
picture
books,
and
highly
illustrated
children's
fiction
up
to
age
nine.
And
it's
just
a
really
joyous
occasion
and
shining
a
light
on
these
fabulous
books
and
hopefully
promoting
them
to
people
far
and
wide
as
really
strong
recommendations
of
these
books
are
excellent
and
every
child
should
read
them.
Excellent.
Ali
8:29
It
was
such
a
joyous
thing,
and
it
really
joyous
to
be
there
at
the
awards
and
also
to
hear
everyone
reading
for
everyone
else.
Sarah
8:37
Yeah.
It's
a
very
friendly
community
feel.
Yeah,
really.
It
is.
It's
it's
such
uh
a
wonderful
one.
And
yeah,
this
the
winners
are
always
amazing,
and
I'm
always
like,
oh,
that's
just
the
perfect
winner
of
to
everyone.
So
in
our
highly
illustrated
children's
fiction
category,
Shantae
Timothy
won
with
supernova.
So
that
is
that's
a
perfect
win.
She's
author,
illustrator,
it's
like
her
entire
concept,
and
it's
absolutely
brilliant.
And
they
she
also
won
our
new,
which
I'll
talk
about
more
hopefully
later,
the
Children's
Choice
Awards.
And
she
she
it's
just
such
a
fun
book
that
kids
just
can't
resist.
Katy
9:12
So
that's
perfect.
Yeah,
we
love
it.
We've
we
have
a
book
club
guide
for
it
at
the
book
clubs
and
schools
hat
on.
Ali
9:18
And
it's
yeah,
we
had
200
children
in
a
hall
with
her.
Sarah
9:23
Yeah,
she's
very
charismatic.
Ali
9:24
Very
much
fun.
Sarah
9:25
Yeah,
yeah.
And
then
the
picture
book
was
The
Beautiful
Layers
of
Me.
And
I
will
just
boast
that
when
this
book
landed
on
my
mat,
I
was
like,
this
is
the
winner.
I
knew
it.
It's
just
so
gorgeous.
I
couldn't
love
it
more.
And
then
the
winner
in
the
baby
and
toddler
category
was
Let's
Play,
which
is
a
very
interesting
one
because
it's
inclusive,
not
just
from
the
perspective
of
the
characters,
but
also
because
it's
a
real
sensory
experience
aimed
at
different
children
to
enjoy.
So
it's
really
special
too.
Katy
9:57
Yeah,
I
know,
really
lovely
set
of
books.
So,
how
can
people
get
involved?
Obviously,
they
can
come
and
find
your
website
and
use
your
resources.
Are
there
other
ways
and
are
there
things
that
you're
doing
in
the
National
Year
of
Reading
that
they
can
get
involved
in?
Sarah
10:12
Yes,
we
are
going
all
in
on
our
shadowing
scheme
for
our
awards.
We
ran
a
small
pilot
last
year,
it
went
really
well,
and
everyone
who
was
involved
was
very
complimentary
about
it.
Now
we're
really
emphasizing
this
and
rolling
it
out.
So,
in
terms
of
the
timeline,
that
would
kick
off
in
autumn.
Right.
And
the
idea
is
that
children
get
to
be
the
judges.
So
we
internally
will
come
up
with
the
short
list
through
our
traditional
judges
and
they'll
whittle
it
down
to
five
books
in
each
of
the
age
categories.
Yeah.
So
baby
and
toddler
picture
books,
highly
illustrated
children's
fiction.
And
then
when
the
shortlist
is
announced
in
January,
so
straight
after
the
beginning
of
term,
participants
would
have
five
weeks
to
read
and
vote
on
the
five
books
in
their
age
category.
And
the
winners
would
be
announced
just
a
couple
of
weeks
after
that
at
the
ceremony,
and
they
get
to
pick
the
school
of
their
choice
to
receive
£250
of
inclusive
books.
But
the
best
thing
is
really
the
participation
for
the
children.
I
think
it's
just
a
really
exciting
way
to
read
this
super
high-quality
selection
of
books
and
then
enjoy
discussing
and
debating
and
really
interactive
with
actually
voting
and
seeing
the
fruits
of
that
come
to
life
very
soon
after.
Katy
11:39
Presumably,
children
will
get
involved
through
parents
and
through
schools,
or
how
do
people
get
involved
in
that
process?
Sarah
11:44
Yeah,
it's
very
open,
but
we
find
that
it
lends
itself
really
well
to
schools
and
also
libraries
and
nurseries.
We
would
encourage
to
participate
as
well
with
the
baby
and
toddler
books.
But
also,
if
anybody
wants
to
participate
from
home
or
maybe
they're
doing
homeschooling,
it
would
be
perfect
as
well.
So
it's
very
easy
for
anyone
to
register,
and
you
can
pre-order
the
book
to
computers
if
you're
a
school
or
a
library,
or
you
can
make
sure
to
order
them
the
moment
that
the
shortlist
is
announced
in
early
January.
Yeah.
And
we've
tried
to
make
it
as
simple
and
user-friendly
as
possible.
It's
just
a
very
simple
form
that
you
fill
in.
So
no
muscle.
And
also
lots
of
fun
resources
with
suggestions
for
whoever's
running
the
group
or
running
this
at
home
to
do
activities
around
the
books
and
ideas
for
conversations
and
resources
for
easy
things
to
out
for,
like
voting
forms,
and
obviously
a
really
cool
sticker
that
says
I
am
an
IBC
Children's
Choice
Award
judge,
that
kind
of
thing.
Nice.
Katy
12:48
And
I
love
the
idea
of
how
do
the
babies
and
toddlers
give
the
feedback?
Um
this
is
intriguing
me.
And
I
think
Ali
12:55
I
think
the
most
chewed.
Sarah
12:59
I
feel
like
also
when
we
say
baby
and
toddler,
we
are
one
plus.
Okay.
So
there
may
be
some
ability
to
communicate
and
verbalise
for
um
in
the
category
of
one
to
three
year
olds.
And
yeah,
admittedly,
maybe
the
ones
that
are
towards
the
older
end
of
that
age
group
will
find
it
more
easy
to
express
a
natural
opinion.
Maybe
it's
also
in
part
going
to
be
up
to
the
person
running
the
group
to
sense
the
mood
and
communicate
it.
Katy
13:29
Yeah.
No,
I
just
love
I
really
like
the
idea
of
giving
a
bunch
of
babies
and
toddlers
books
and
going,
seeing
what
they
do
with
them.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It'll
be
good.
But
you
know
the
ones
that
that
they
sit
with
and
turn
the
pages
backwards
and
forwards
and
backwards
and
forwards,
and
as
Ali
says,
give
them
a
chew
or…
brilliant.
Is
there
anything
else
that
you're
doing
in
the
National
Year
of
Reading?
We
don't
we
don't
we
we
have
no
kind
of
pressure
on
anyone
to
be
doing
anything
special
because
we
know
everything
will
still
be
here
after
the
National
Year
of
Reading.
Sarah
14:00
We
will
still
be
here
after
the
National
Reading
for
sure.
But
I
think
another
initiative
that
people
might
be
interested
to
know
about
is
our
IBC
book
box
scheme,
which
is
a
book
gifting
scheme
for
state
schools.
And
we're
going
to
bump
it
up
this
year
to
a
hundred
boxes
of
a
hundred
books,
a
hundred
inclusive
children's
books,
and
it's
absolutely
our
ultimate
top
100
inclusive
children's
books
of
all
time.
The
most
beautiful
collection,
and
we'll
have
a
hundred
of
those
up
for
grabs.
And
honestly,
any
state
school
that
can
submit
a
compelling
non-AI
application
is
a
shoe-in.
It's
really
worth
applying.
So
I
hope
that
anybody
who's
eligible
will
consider
applying
for
that,
or
anybody
who
whose
kid
goes
to
a
school
that
could
do
with
some
new
books,
or
anyone
at
all
will
encourage
them
to
apply.
Ali
14:54
So
that
could
that
could
be
a
librarian
or
a
member
of
a
school
community
who
thinks
their
school
would
be,
yeah.
And
is
it
just
a
written
application?
Is
it
online?
Sarah
15:03
Yeah,
again,
it's
just
a
form.
We
can
try
to
make
it
as
light
touch
as
possible.
We
just
need
a
quite
short
but
sincere
explanation
of
why
people
would
like
to
have
these
books
and
what
they
would
do
with
them.
That's
all
we
need.
Katy
15:19
Yeah.
Ali
15:20
Perfect.
Katy
15:21
Is
there
anything
else
you
want
to
tell
us
about?
Sarah
15:24
I'm
just
wondering
whether
to
also
mention
that
there
is
our
serious
book
gifting
scheme,
but
we
are
holding
one
of
those
boxes
back
for
just
a
special
social
media
competition,
which
really
will
just
be
a
kind
of
popularity
contest,
and
whichever
school
gets
the
most
votes
on
our
leaderboard
will
get
one
of
those
boxes.
Katy
15:47
So
that's
an
alternative
route
to
getting
the
box.
Okay,
so
marshal
all
your
social
media
warriors
in
your
school
to
vote
for
you.
Ali
15:55
Yeah,
that's
fun.
Okay,
sounds
good.
And
as
you
say,
it's
a
fun
way
to
amplify
the
awards
and
just
get
people
thinking
about
it.
Sarah
16:02
That's
it.
Katy
16:02
Yeah,
great.
Yeah,
sounds
good.
So
finally,
what
are
your
hopes
for
the
National
Year
of
Reading?
What
do
you
hope
it
will
achieve?
Sarah
16:09
Oh,
I
just
want
every
child
to
discover
the
contentment
of
settling
down
to
a
wonderful
book
and
the
joy
of
being
swept
off
on
an
adventure
from
just
a
wonderful
story
in
this
magical
object
in
your
hands.
And
also
I
just
want
them
to
have
these
benefits
of
this
exposure
to
something
that
is
just
so
healthy
for
your
brain
development
and
state
of
mind.
Katy
16:37
Yeah,
brilliant.
Thank
you.
Thank
you
so
much.